Recovered post and comments.

March 4, 2017

People who have recently been exposed to Freedomain Radio podcasts and videos probably accessed them for an in-depth analysis of current events, as the material seems quite popular with the sceptic “community”, as well as the alt-right (the two seeming to fuse nowadays on social media).

Unbeknownst to new listeners, this group is a proper cult aimed at reaching young people at the age of individuation; it used to convince them to separate from their families by cutting all contact, a practice known as “defooing”, which has its dedicated website for members, defoo.org, reminiscent of Scientology or the Exclusive Brethren. Although apparently the advocacy for this has stopped (perhaps for legal reasons) the consequences remain.

The young people lured through discussions about politics, ethics, dogmas and so forth were encouraged to analyse their entire lives in ways which would lead them to think their families were morally corrupt and sabotaging them psychologically, at an age of being prone to rebelling naturally, which exacerbated the effect. They were encouraged to move out of their homes, which led to homelessness in various cases and at least one suicide, leaving behind dumbfounded families who only understood what had happened when discovering their children’s interest in Freedomain Radio.

From the start, members were told it was their duty to “get out there” and “become active” in order to help create a better world, and that occasional support such as the odd donation or product purchase was not enough for them to consider themselves “part of the conversation”.

As former members recounted, the group went way beyond what abuse recovery forums do, as it encouraged them to publicly berate the families trying to bring them back, even reading out private letters and emails for the world to hear, which reaches a deeply disturbing level of arrogance. Instead of the promised liberation, young people found themselves increasingly depersonalised, at least two describing a loss of interest for anything outside of group discussions.

Ad-hoc psychoanalysis was used by the leader to mimic a deep bond and understanding; it was also employed towards “recovering repressed memories”, in order to further antagonise them against their parents or even siblings and friends. They even used to provide those who wished to leave their families with a standard “goodbye letter”, in case they felt they could not formulate their own. Moreover, some of the most dedicated members ended up living together after “defooing”.

The group remains very popular today, continuing to attract those who consider themselves anti-system. Akin to any cult, they reject what their former peers have brought to light and berate them for being “weak enough to return to their morally corrupt families”.

There is plenty material on YouTube and dedicated sites, consisting of testimonies from former members and their loved ones, as well as the input of cult experts, confirming the nature of these dynamics.

17 COMMENTS

Lisa
Maria,

Do all of these activities revolve around the woman referred to as Madame BlaFatsky, online? Don’t for heavens sakes use her real name. Many people have been driven over the edge simply trying to spell it correctly….talk about being in real consonant as well as her org’s contrived constant crisis!

No less disturbing is her propensity for launching threats to sue those who refer to her org. as a ‘cult.’

And isn’t she the one who had her hooks into PsychopathFree?

Ugly, ugly organization. Thanks for the links. I will check it out.
MARCH 6, 2017

 

Maria
I know who you mean, but no, this is a group started by someone claiming to be an authority on anarchism, philosophy and ethics (Stefan Molyneux). It was surprising to come across all of it after sporadically listening to his approach on current events, politics and other issues; the guy is very articulate and can spin a conversation very well, but I had no idea what his ideology was; if you hear it in bits you might think he’s eccentric but reasonable.

They are similar to PF in one important way – they prey on the vulnerable, in this case the immature who are still trying to figure things out. They make them think they’ve been mentally sabotaged by their families, that those around them are stupid and dangerous and they should only talk to “those who understand what life is about” (their cult, that is). A former member said they were routinely told that if the group and their thinking did not grow there would be major disasters and it was their responsibility to prevent that.

It’s not slander as I’ve seen videos of him expressing extreme views, for instance, if people believe in the concept of a state, they must want anarchists shot, therefore anarchists should reject the company of the majority (“you can’t be a libertarian if you share your life with statists”, something like that). His wife also used her position as a therapist to push for separation and was sanctioned for it when it got out. First they cloak it in trying to make young people see how they’ve been abused, then, once they’ve got them hooked, they make it political. There is of course financial exploitation as well, with various levels of membership based on how much you pay. The more you pay, the more access you gain to the “leader” and more sophisticated material; 500 dollars get you into the “inner circle”, as a former member called it.

It’s funny how these groups always use the same method, of making people think they are the “chosen ones” with the “only true understanding”.
MARCH 6, 2017

 

Maria
One story was even covered by The Guardian a few years ago.https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2008/nov/15/family-relationships-fdr-defoo-cult

There are many people online who have no idea what this guy is about and listen to his stuff on social media.
MARCH 6, 2017

 

Lisa
Thanks Maria,

I have heard his name but that’s as far as I got. I ignore anything with “freedom” or reference to it, in its title. Nobody really understands ‘freedom,’ as it is a concept that is so fraught with paradox, its use is meaningless or comes to mean what we generally regard as its opposite.
MARCH 6, 2017

 

Maria
It seems to be that way. You really can’t tell just by listening to a few videos. Apparently some people were so mesmerised they listened to all… 3000 or 4000 of them, can’t remember, and in between wrote goodbye notes to their families.
MARCH 6, 2017

 

Lisa
I just read the Guardian article. Maybe Tom will have children one day and suffer the same chilling fate.

I had major problems with my parents. There was real abuse, physical and emotional. Still, I had enough compassion for their own f’d up-ness passed on from their f’d up generational and familial milieu that I would not have wanted them to suffer the tortures of the damned. I am no different than most of my generation, in this regard.

But, I was never brainwashed or emotionally dominated by a cult or group of any kind when I was young and more impressionable.

There will be more emphasis on the reinvigoration of cult activity in modern times, in the future — hopefully.
MARCH 6, 2017

 

Maria
It’s a bit scary to see how many people have a hidden need for attention, validation, affection etc and end up in the fishnet of such characters. Even those who are aware of cults are sometimes blind to what they’re getting into. There should have been major red flags, yet these kids were so young they were the ideal prey.

Maybe the problem is in how we are programmed to seek authority and dogmas or doctrines in order to function. We want to think for ourselves and yet we seek mentors to teach us how to do it and end up brainwashed. I’m sure some groups are harmless, but when an authority figure is involved, it just goes downhill.
MARCH 6, 2017

 

Lisa
I think we are hard wired to follow or heed the opinions of strong personalities. As damaging as it can be, it can also promote social cohesion — if those who follow are encouraged to think, rather than just emote and \’believe\’ without questioning.

Highly intelligent leaders who don\’t have rampant character disorders are a rarity these days. The .001% elite monied class have no use for them, so they gain little traction. But this might change. I have hope

The left versus right kabuki theater might just be exposed for what it is, through Trump. And, if it is, something entirely new and positive might take it\’s place.

Currently, the spirit of the times, in the U.S, demands someone be punished.

When Trump demonized undocumented Hispanics, seeking economic refuge in the U.S. by referring to them as rapists and murderers, I understood immediately he was using the fascist populist playbook to set this group up for vicious scapegoating.

The same goes for Islamic \’terrorists\’ in the U.S. even though 99% of mass shootings and killings are carried out by disenfranchised white men — in other words, Trump supporters.

And the looney radical left in academia is hyper focused on \’micro\’ aggressions, for f***s sakes!

Western European and American academia have taken some kind of u- turn into Crazy town.
MARCH 10, 2017

 

Maria
I agree, and though it’s difficult to see a better future, at the same time it’s fantastic to take the pulse of social media and see more people by the day calling the bullshit out for what it is and disowning the so-called “rebellious defenders of the west”, many of whom are simply right-wing pundits playing on public fear.

For many months I was into that type of content and had developed a habit of rejecting contrary arguments as mendacious leftist propaganda.

Then, when the deportations started happening, I waited for days and weeks for the people I had respected as presumed humanists to cover this issue in their usual profound way. They didn’t. Some later did in a very surprising way – gloating and laughing and dehumanising economic migrants. They had turned into Fox News. Every other video they made was about Trump being right, Trump being wonderful and all criticism of him being a vicious attack, even when his behaviour defied common sense.

And I realised that the students we were so fond of laughing at for being ridiculous were nowhere near as important or threatening as the rise of this mentality. It was like waking up from a New Year’s Eve party with a massive hangover.
MARCH 10, 2017

 

Lisa
Hi Maria,

You would have caught on sooner if you lived in the U.S or Canada, as it would be right in your back yard.

Minority groups are being marginalized and criminalized. First it was the blacks — and so many young black men are in jail now, I honestly think that is why Hispanics are being demonized by Trump.

And I am not at all surprised that the hard right are cheering him on. Resentment has been building for ages among the white population who have, so far, been marginalized for any number of reasons — lack of education, rust belt roots, coal mining ancestry, loss of hope and all the attendant drug and alcohol issues.

The only jobs left are in the service industry amd guess who garners many of these jobs? Hispanics. And do they drive wages down? Of course. Particularly if they are undocumented — and have zero leverage to bargain, either collectively or individually, for higher wages and better working conditions.

There is a genuine economic displacement issue there– and Trump ran with it. Is it morally correct ? Hell no! He is knowingly turning pent up resentment into white hot anger and contempt, instead of addressing the issue in a level headed, fair manner…something that should have been done decades ago.

So far, the people who have been running the show benefited disproportionately from a system that turned a blind eye to what was happening to its own white underclass, while it employed Hispanic nannies , servants, gardeners, handymen — many of whom are undocumented.

This is what I try to point out to my white professional class Canadian friends. It wasn’t a racial bigotry issue, it was and is a jobs issue. And the reason ‘liberals’ particularly in the U.S. don’t get that is because they, for some reason can’t put themselves in the shoes of the underclass.

It’s weird and a lot of it has to do with an over focus on race, over class. And that is the impetus that diverts the analysis in academia down blind allies of gender and race, as well. Labelling the underclass as ‘racist,’ in blazing red letters is thought stopping sloganeering — on the part of liberals.

I blame the the managerial and ruling class for creating an atmosphere that is ripe for a demigogue. Many who support Trump are in a torch and pitchfork state of mind. Others, in spite of growing evidence to the contrary, believe he is a great international peace maker.

It makes sense to me and it is what I have feared since I saw the twin towers come down. The U.S is becoming a police state and more of an overt one. Anybody who steps out of line, in the future, regardless of race, is going to be punished severely. It started with blacks, now it’s Hispanics too. Very soon it will be the white underclass, and then it will move up into what is left of the middle class, regardless of colour.
MARCH 11, 2017

 

Maria
I know; it certainly seems that different factions are prodding people into actually hating each other, as SJW-ish as that sounds. Lower and middle class people might want to understand who their real peers are – certainly not howling, fear-mongering millionaires such as Alex Jones or Donald Trump. It’s amazing to me they would think an obscenely rich guy who has screwed over normal folks as often as given a chance cares about them in the slightest. Plus, although I understand illegal immigration does cause problems as well, there is a large grey area on this subject. I’ve read articles regarding former mass deportation policies which resulted in financial losses in a few US states, as no locals stepped up to replace immigrants in farm work, which is very demanding physically. It’s the same here in the UK (mainly England) where people complain of foreign workers doing demanding low-paid work, yet wouldn’t necessarily care to do it themselves. Rhetoric is one thing and practice is another, apparently.
MARCH 11, 2017

 

 

Lisa
Hi again! Liberals will hyper focus on the negatives of deporting the undocumented, which is fair. I think it ‘s ham handed and cruel to indulge in mass deportations, in particular.

Yet…they truly do ignore the very real problems that massive waves of desperately poor foreigners can cause for those at the very bottom.

There is a horse and cart dynamic to the whole, “they are just doing what white people won’t do!” And I am describing migrant farm workers, here.

If governments had forbidden the practise, to begin with, it would have driven wages up in the agricultural sector and plenty of citizens, particularly students, would have been happy to work these farm jobs in the late summer and through the Fall, much like many of them do now, in reforestation projects. Those jobs are back breaking but pay very well, because they fall outside of the purview of ‘agriculture.’

Of course, it means we would all pay more for food. But in that atmosphere, everything readjusts and house prices come down, for example.

It is a huge grey area. And the standard argument, too, is that immigrants create jobs as much as they take jobs. I think that one also has to be seen through the lens of modern technology, and automation, where the pie of employment isn’t expanding, nor is it finite. It is shrinking.

So, there are distinct problems that are very real and that require strong compassionate leadership that protects the vulnerable, everywhere — documented or not.

It does no good for Liberals to dismiss the problems of the disaffected with what amounts to sloganeering. Everyone’s employment problems, deserve to be examined on a singular basis, undocumented workers too. There, now I am firmly back in SJW territory. Whew…this special snowflake darned near melted typing those last few paragraphs!
MARCH 11, 2017

 

Maria
I’m starting to realise more and more that labels mean nothing, especially for those who think for themselves and reserve the right to a nuanced view. If you’re apolitical, by just spending one day on social media, you can end up with every label imaginable, according to the topics you approach. You can be called a Nazi, an SJW, a communist, a religious bigot, a mangina, a shill etc, despite not being any of those things. It’s funny how this overwhelming access to information from sources of any persuasion has not led to meeting others halfway but to a stricter division of so-called ideological groups into even smaller boxes. In fact it would be appropriate to write a whole post just based on that, in terms of how groupthink manifests. Yes, I agree with you, this issue is very complex and should not be reduced to sloganeering on either side.
MARCH 11, 2017

 

Lisa
Maria, I think one of the drivers of hard divisions is Facebook. I am not on it but from what I can glean from others, it creates a reality tunnel or echo chamber for the user by feeding them I formation based on what they post…their opinions affiliations etc…

I think Google news does this, to a degree too.
MARCH 11, 2017

 

Maria
I have suspected it for many years, though at the time it was largely seen as a conspiracy theory. Have you heard of the new app called Candid, which a bunch of people in the so-called “sceptic”, anti-SJW community advertised for? Well, it’s worse than anything to date, with artificial intelligence to determine the “sentiment” in your post, the “quality” of your post, the “truthfulness” of it etc. After some time I understand you get a label according to your activity. Also, they get yo move your threads and posts around so you only end up speaking to people who agree with you. How dystopian is that? And yet it was promoted by high calibre defenders of free speech on social media. Not kidding!
MARCH 11, 2017

 

Lisa
I feel life should afford the individual boundless opportunities for a necessary change of opinions. If this is frustrated life’s key purpose is defeated. This appears to me to be a mental and spiritual prison.

Those who advocate for these algorithmic apps often use terms relating to “when I woke up,” or “when I became enlightened!” How easy for the app to put them in touch with others who use similar language to such ill effect. They have booby trapped themselves into a corner with this.
MARCH 11, 2017

 

Maria
I’m the same. And even though I might contradict someone today I know they might well change their opinion tomorrow, just like I have so many times. Or I might discover new information which might help me understand their viewpoint better (unless it’s actually extreme and plain wrong). Either way, people should not segregate themselves in this manner.

I did for about a year, or more, and completely lost perspective in the process, while always listening to viewpoints contradicting feminism or leftist commentators, ridiculed almost daily by the people I’d given my attention (and trust of objectivity) to.

Without switching to the left (as I’m not switching ever again to anything), I have to admit that listening to those people, without the biased right-wing/ “sceptic” nitpicking in between, they are not unreasonable or idiotic in the slightest.

It shows me the extent of human frailty and need to belong to a certain ideological tribe, and the way it can skew people’s perspective altogether. Agreeing out of perceived solidarity does not equate to intellectual honesty. I can see that very clearly now.
MARCH 12, 2017